TSN 1040 RIP

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Re: TSN 1040 RIP

Postby talker2002@gmail.com » Wed Feb 24, 2021 2:49 pm

No reason to involve the CRTC? How about ignoring the terms of the license and doing what you want? That's not supposed to be allowed. Owners get to have a license by promising to adhere to certain programming promises. If you don't live up to those promises you may have a price to pay. While I don't maintain the CRTC as the ultimate governing body, they are all we have at this time. They should jump in more often than they do and as the regulator, make rule breakers answer.
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Re: TSN 1040 RIP

Postby groundskeeper willy » Wed Feb 24, 2021 3:33 pm

Sorry talker2002@gmail.com, don't quite understand your contention about involving the CRTC. To the best of my knowledge, there's nothing here that's violating any rule or condition of licence. Bell has an AM signal, which pretty much everyone will agree, is not exactly a ratings winner. They ran a format that, due to changing economic conditions, became unfeasible. They pivoted to something else. Are you angry because you're a sports fan and no longer have it as an option for listening? How are they "rule breakers"? Please elaborate and clarify your position and thinking on the subject.
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Re: TSN 1040 RIP

Postby Aaron » Wed Feb 24, 2021 4:31 pm

Marathon wrote:
Aaron wrote:Formats on AM aren't regulated. It's a free-for-all as long as it remains in English.

Don't know if comedy bits count as "songs"....if they do they'll need to keep the 35% up, but I don't think so.

There's really nothing to involve the CRTC in.


Comedy bits don't count as songs


Thank-you. I'd assumed so, but didn't want to go all-in on that given that I've never had to actually know.
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Re: TSN 1040 RIP

Postby Marathon » Wed Feb 24, 2021 7:29 pm

groundskeeper willy wrote:Sorry talker2002@gmail.com, don't quite understand your contention about involving the CRTC. To the best of my knowledge, there's nothing here that's violating any rule or condition of licence. Bell has an AM signal, which pretty much everyone will agree, is not exactly a ratings winner. They ran a format that, due to changing economic conditions, became unfeasible. They pivoted to something else. Are you angry because you're a sports fan and no longer have it as an option for listening? How are they "rule breakers"? Please elaborate and clarify your position and thinking on the subject.


I agree 100% I don't offer any comment on the value of either format, I didn't listen to them as a sports station and have no interest in listening to the comedy format either. However, there is nothing evident in the new format that is out of compliance. Obviously they have used the format in Calgary and Hamilton and there were no issues. Also, these companies take compliance very seriously, for PDs and MDs nothing will get you fired faster than your station being out of compliance.
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Re: TSN 1040 RIP

Postby radio knob » Wed Feb 24, 2021 11:20 pm

Aaron wrote:
Marathon wrote:
Aaron wrote:Formats on AM aren't regulated. It's a free-for-all as long as it remains in English.

Don't know if comedy bits count as "songs"....if they do they'll need to keep the 35% up, but I don't think so.

There's really nothing to involve the CRTC in.


Comedy bits don't count as songs


Thank-you. I'd assumed so, but didn't want to go all-in on that given that I've never had to actually know.


Very informative. I did not know about the AM free market rules.
If Bell really was losing money on these stations then why not just shut it down? Can they walk away from the licence? And selling gets you back into CRTC paperwork I assume.
Could Funny actually make money? Sure they can run it cheap but if no one is listening ad time is worth nothing.

Yes I liked the station, I tune in long distance now only on occasion and just happened to be listening that morning so it was news happening live on the air.
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Re: TSN 1040 RIP

Postby WheresFredTaylor » Thu Feb 25, 2021 11:07 am

I have a hard time believing Bell was losing money on 1040. They weren't paying a bloated cost for NHL rights and with how much syndicated programming they run out of Toronto would keep costs down. Now maybe other TSN stations aren't doing as well (I've heard rumours that no radio rights holders are in the black) and the decision makers in Toronto wanted to refocus those dollars in broadcast markets.

I guess one never knows the true details but to me, 1040 wouldn't have had a roster of inflated salaries either. Guessing Sekeres and Price were their biggest earners.
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Re: TSN 1040 RIP

Postby Aaron » Thu Feb 25, 2021 12:36 pm

I'd expect 1040 was making a decent profit pre-pandemic. They were likely running at a loss over the past year or so.

The 12+ ratings made public don't have much relation to the sales potential of any given station, and that's doubly true for sports radio, which is sold in some more unique ways.

The longer-term thinking of course wold be to wait things out and adjust, but when the company directive is to slash and burn, it's a pretty attractive target.

As for putting on filler formats rather than just shutting down, there are a couple reasons. Many companies feel there is value in just having the license should a technological or regulatory change even the playing field with existing FM stations. Secondly, a new or existing competitor could then grab the frequency and do something that takes revenue away from your other stations. So yeah, they're essentially squatting.
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Re: TSN 1040 RIP

Postby rwbrown » Mon Mar 01, 2021 12:11 pm

radio knob wrote:
Aaron wrote:
Marathon wrote:Formats on AM aren't regulated. It's a free-for-all as long as it remains in English.

Don't know if comedy bits count as "songs"....if they do they'll need to keep the 35% up, but I don't think so.

There's really nothing to involve the CRTC in.


Comedy bits don't count as songs


Very informative. I did not know about the AM free market rules.
If Bell really was losing money on these stations then why not just shut it down? Can they walk away from the license? And selling gets you back into CRTC paperwork I assume.
Could Funny actually make money? Sure they can run it cheap but if no one is listening ad time is worth nothing.

Yes I liked the station, I tune in long distance now only on occasion and just happened to be listening that morning so it was news happening live on the air.


I'm finding this "free for all" rules on AM because it is a talk format hard to believe. There was talk and a review of policy and rumors of deregulation, but didn't realize it was that free form. The comment about being strictly above board and in compliance is true, so this is fascinating. That is why I am scratching my head as to how they are doing it? Subbing comedy bits for sports content I get. It is the part about having no local content. Don't you have to account for the amount of local content in the POP and playing a jukebox of comedy bits and station promos doesn't quite add up. Are there no local surveillance requirements?

Just asking out of sheer curiosity.
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Re: TSN 1040 RIP

Postby groundskeeper willy » Mon Mar 01, 2021 2:07 pm

The regs for AM talk stations are pretty minimal, to say the least. Biggest thing the CRTC looks for is having a functioning studio for the market the signal covers, and with Bell having a dedicated control room for Funny 1040, this item gets checked off the list. But wait, you may ask, what about local programming? Isn't there some sort of regulation covering that? Since all the content being broadcast on the station originates off a hard drive in the building, it's technically all 'local programming'. If the station was simply taking a syndicated network feed and doing local commercial inserts, that would be a very different situation, but that's not what Bell is doing. Also factor in the various traffic breaks that may/may not be running during the day and whatever other interstitial content that appears on the station (voiced by a local 'host' in the building), and voila! That hurdle of 'local programming' is cleared as well.

For everybody who thinks that there's something here for the CRTC to investigate, hate to break it to you, but Bell has been running this exact format for years on the AM band in other markets. If the CRTC had any issue with any of Bell's business practices or adherence to licence conditions, it would have been tabled and dealt with a long time ago.
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Re: TSN 1040 RIP

Postby Marathon » Mon Mar 01, 2021 4:05 pm

groundskeeper willy wrote:The regs for AM talk stations are pretty minimal, to say the least. Biggest thing the CRTC looks for is having a functioning studio for the market the signal covers, and with Bell having a dedicated control room for Funny 1040, this item gets checked off the list. But wait, you may ask, what about local programming? Isn't there some sort of regulation covering that? Since all the content being broadcast on the station originates off a hard drive in the building, it's technically all 'local programming'. If the station was simply taking a syndicated network feed and doing local commercial inserts, that would be a very different situation, but that's not what Bell is doing. Also factor in the various traffic breaks that may/may not be running during the day and whatever other interstitial content that appears on the station (voiced by a local 'host' in the building), and voila! That hurdle of 'local programming' is cleared as well.

For everybody who thinks that there's something here for the CRTC to investigate, hate to break it to you, but Bell has been running this exact format for years on the AM band in other markets. If the CRTC had any issue with any of Bell's business practices or adherence to licence conditions, it would have been tabled and dealt with a long time ago.


I agree with everything stated here.

Normally when attempting to figure out if there are any conditions of license one can go in and review everything in the CRTC's decision regarding that station. In this particular case I think the license is so old that if there were any conditions it would be difficult to figure out what they are. It got me thinking about the history of what are actually the two different stations that constitute what is now CKST 1040.

As I recall, CKST was originally CJJC 850. they moved to 800 around 1970 and at some point morphed in to CJUP and then finally to CKST branded as Coast attempting to be a Top 40 station in the late 80s with Chuck Chandler as PD and AM Drive. From there they moved to a modern rock format with Dave Marsden as the PD. Then they bought 1040 with the idea that somehow they would get better ratings doing modern rock as a Vancouver station which they didn't, I remember that they applied for an FM license at one point and got denied. The history of 1040 is also kind of a jigsaw puzzle. They started off as CIOF which I think was AC and I remember Don Hamilton was part of it. Then they they went Top 40 at some point as CKXY branded as 1040 Kicks and Paul McKnight was the PD, then they moved to a short lived format known as Rock 40. I think they may have been branded as Rock 1040 for a while. After that they were adult standards for a bit as CIMA branded as Magic 104. After the purchase and the failure of the modern rock format I remember them doing some kind of a talk station for a while but then the guy who owned it got killed in a car accident and subsequently it was bought by CHUM and for a while was part of their TEAM network. Eventually CHUM got bought by Bell and that's where we are now. Sorry if I missed anything.
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